Over the last decade and half I have met many pastors and teachers who use the “umbrella of authority” model from Gothard with no idea of the original source. And on the surface it does have some resemblance to the historical Christian understanding of authority, so it is certainly an understandable mistake to make. But given that the umbrella model was originated by a heretical teacher, it’s probably better not to use it instead of trying to reframe the historical Christian doctrine on top of Gothard’s model. Here’s a link that discusses how Gothard differs from historical Protestant teaching. https://midwestoutreach.org/2023/03/23/everyone-i-dont-like-is-literally-gothard/

Oh yay, Bill Gothard’s umbrella of authority is back. I always thought that “goat herd” was indeed an appropriate name for that wolf.

I call Christ ‘King’ precisely because I see Him crucified. For it is the mark of a king to die for the sake of his subjects. –St John Chrysostom

Impressive response, clearly you have done your homework with regard to icons. Two key points: Keeping your painting of Christ as shepherd is totally consistent with early Christian practice. Just don’t venerate it, treat it as educational. I jumped in with the original thread here because I was concerned about you equating a painting of Christ with an idol, which it absolutely is not. You reference irenaeus regarding icons, curious about the particular text? I’d love to look that up.

Oh hey. Just followed your new account.

This post is in response to Laser, who just nuked his account and started a new one that I have yet to find. As a former reformed Baptist myself, I can deeply appreciate the consistency and conviction with which you are approaching this. If Calvin’s position on icons is correct, then you are doing the right thing. However, Calvin is objectively and provably not correct. Ultimately the Holy Fathers of the 7th ecumenical council were articulating the faith “once delivered to the saints” when they ruled for the veneration of icons. The basic idea that “veneration of the image passes to the prototype” is a key lynchpin of both trinitarian theology and Christian ethics. That concept underlines how the commandment to love God and love neighbor are not in conflict. We show our love for God by honoring each image of God around us. St. John says: “If someone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen?” (1 John 4:20) The underlying logic that St. John uses is the theology of the icon: by loving the image (ikon) we see, we honor the unseen one who is imaged. In other words, “what you have done to the least of these, you have done to me” as Christ says. The action or honor given to the ikon (the human being made in the image of God) passes to the prototype: Christ. Without this concept, all Christian ethics and morality fails. The following link is something I found really helpful during my exploration of the theology of icons from a reformed perspective. Lots of great articles on the blog but this one in particular deals with John Calvin. https://orthodoxbridge.com/2016/02/03/the-illogic-of-calvins-iconoclasm/

Is the veneration of icons in the Church something that was added by converted pagans in later centuries? Evidence suggests that icons have always been part of the Church and even existed within 2nd temple Judaism. https://orthodoxbridge.com/2023/08/24/are-icons-an-accretion-a-response-to-gavin-ortlund/

And yet he let Al-qaeda take over Syria. Interesting strategy. 4D chess I’m sure. 🙄

The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly. (John 10:10) If you see anyone focusing on stealing, killing and destroying, you know who they work for.

I’m a voice crying in the wilderness calling for Standard Time instead of DST. The Sun matters: solar noon is the true noon. our temporary technological bubble makes us think we can ignore it. Look: if everyone wants to start working at 7 am and get off work at 4, that’s fine with me. But let’s call it what it actually is rather than pretending that we actually changed time itself.